tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post8371294418917478212..comments2024-03-27T09:14:27.496+00:00Comments on All That Is Solid ...: Support for SWP Central Committee StatementPhilhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06298147857234479278noreply@blogger.comBlogger48125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-44588252429669243162015-03-23T00:30:04.070+00:002015-03-23T00:30:04.070+00:00Revive an old thread.
Some of the 14 SWP candidate...Revive an old thread.<br />Some of the 14 SWP candidates standing under TUSC banner.<br />Edinburgh East Ayesha Saleem; <br />Glasgow North Angela McCormick;<br />Barnsley Central Dave Gibson;<br />Sheffield Brightside & Hillsborough Maxine Bowler;<br />Leeds Central Liz Kitching; <br />Portsmouth North Jon Woods.<br />Names seem familiar<br /><br />Vinyl Minerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14143010575470895405noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-61209336062708749712013-04-20T01:07:31.063+01:002013-04-20T01:07:31.063+01:00A couple of interesting facts about the list. One ...A couple of interesting facts about the list. One person on it has been accused of rape in the past and another engages in dogging by his own admission. What a bunch.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-56364785330885101232013-04-18T22:44:13.558+01:002013-04-18T22:44:13.558+01:00http://averypublicsociologist.blogspot.co.uk
It ha...http://averypublicsociologist.blogspot.co.uk<br />It has just been brought to my attention that you have published an internal Socialist Workers’ Party document including my and other signatories, on to a public blog without permission. I would like to make the following clear:<br />a) The signatories who are members of this union continue to support the SWP’s handling of this difficult issue, but would like to make it clear that it would be inappropriate to infer that this means the EIS has a view on it or has a locus in this issue.<br />b) The signatories that you have published including EIS next to our first names and surname initials, signed the document in a personal capacity and not on behalf of our trade union, the EIS. <br />If you are not prepared to take down this document from your blog, or remove all references to the EIS, I request that the above is publish the above to make this clear.<br />Penny Gower, Edinburgh<br />Penny Gowernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-77117647334393742892013-03-25T03:58:27.634+00:002013-03-25T03:58:27.634+00:00Paul Blackledge from Leeds is on this list. What ...Paul Blackledge from Leeds is on this list. What a hypocrite. He was hauled up in front of the Party many years ago for using SWSS as a personal harem. Shame on him!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-65717564089876040132013-03-11T08:59:42.651+00:002013-03-11T08:59:42.651+00:00Always wondered what the S in SWP stood for. Shari...Always wondered what the S in SWP stood for. Sharia? Sexist? Shattered? Split? Superannuated? Shit?Will Podmorenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-77730268250348703722013-03-06T16:41:52.778+00:002013-03-06T16:41:52.778+00:00I was in the SWP during the 80's and 90's....I was in the SWP during the 80's and 90's. Deep down, I can't say I am surprised. One ex CC'er who has since died was notorious in our day picking up young, impressionable women. I saw his behavour first hand in Skegness which was quite frankly disgraceful.<br />I didn't know Comrade Delta terribly well, but in my day there were behaviours as serious, if not more that what was alleged against him.<br />This is only the tip of the iceberg and I feel looking at all the leaked documents that The SWP is finished in my mind. You don't appreciate the dogma until you experience it from the other side. I'm glad I left the SWP which accounted for so much of my time and money.<br />Some of the people on the current CC and staff I knew very well and it is sad to see how they have ended up.<br />Life outside of the SWP is bright, less angry and much more connected into real life. The SWP is an unhealthy environment. It reminds me of the Catholic Church. The parallels are uncanny. No doubt it will take time for it to finally disband, but one thing is for sure, it has lost all credibility and as a force it is finished. The conciousness laggs way behind the reality of the situation. It will take time, but it will manifest itself to people that this is so.<br /><br />Farewell SWP. It was nice knowing you. We had some good times, but we have outgrown you. Your time has passed.<br /><br />Adrian (Leeds)noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-85325507052746229292013-03-01T00:58:37.702+00:002013-03-01T00:58:37.702+00:00Weary, Weary,wasn't going to answer but... SWP...Weary, Weary,wasn't going to answer but... SWP members in the main are employees of the state or the oppresive arms of the state. Why,it is their aim to take control of that state. Braverman as a cultist was as separated from the reality of labour and the working class as Cliff was. His approach is basically tarted up Luddism. I find it ironic that you quote a Trotskyist text dated 1974, this is around the time Cliff started the expulsion of Shop Steward militants from the IS. This is when the SWP retreated to their middle class "fantasy" world of being the Revolutionary Party. They shat themselves during the shop stewards movement and haven't made any contact with industrial workers since. It is ironic that the main fault of Bannerman and the SWP, US or GB, is they have not recognised the strength of class division, and what class they are actually in. I rarely argue with cultists, political or religious, but in relation to the SWP it has no reason to exist. I do find your Stahanovite quote amusing as I am the exact opposite.jimboonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-69162865121939565832013-02-28T22:34:03.627+00:002013-02-28T22:34:03.627+00:00Dearest Jimboo
Indeed people can make up their o...Dearest Jimboo <br /><br />Indeed people can make up their own mind: my only previous contribution to this debate was at http://www.urban75.net/forums/threads/swp-expulsions-and-squabbles.303876/page-231<br /><br />and in the unlikely event that folk are interested (apparently like you were! )in following my previous contributions they can make their own judgment. <br /><br />I will add that my contribution was intended, not as ‘defence’ of Martin Smith - whose behaviour from what I have read is inexcusable on a number of counts - but a broader wariness of some people casting other relationships between consenting adults as ‘inappropriate’ from a distance. As someone in a same-sex relationship I am aware as to how that label has been as a veil for discrimination in the past, and continues to be used in a number of other countries around the world. <br /><br />I also agree that people can speak for themselves which is why I wondered about your previous comment here that: “The Class are not happy at all”; alongside a number of other comments from which suggested you have a privileged insight into other people’s thoughts. However I must now acknowledge my error. You don’t think that you have the privileged position of speaking for the working class; rather you you have the privelege of determining who the working class are in the first place! Obviously (shock horror!) no-one who has had that bourgeois impetus to pick up a book (or even more shock horror!!) a degree can be deemed working class. They are ‘professional’ and ‘middle class fantasists’ and worthy of your contempt. Worst of all having a degree might mean you go on to become a teacher (pah!) or even a lecturer (pah! pah!) –and clearly these middle class fantasists can be discarded and sidelined as enemies of the working class!<br /><br />Given that Braverman’s Labour and Monopoly Capital challenged such an archaic, monolithic view of working class identity back in 1974 I can only assume that your roots in the left (if indeed you truly have any) are in the 1950s CPGB. If that is the case all I can say is that it’s sad for you that society changed while you stood still.<br /><br />One final comment as a piece of advice – be careful as you type that response : your Stakhanovite fingers might fall off if they continue to come into contact with something as ‘middle class’ and ‘professional’ as a computer. Best chisel out a response on stone by banging your head against it – your head seeming to be your least valuable body part. <br /><br />Lots of love,<br /><br />Ben xxBen Sorinnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-69913833233363770482013-02-28T13:54:34.536+00:002013-02-28T13:54:34.536+00:00Oh dear why must I feed the trolls. When as a shop...Oh dear why must I feed the trolls. When as a shop steward I found out the working class are quite able to speak for themselves, I never speak for the "Class". The SWP are totally separated from the working class and have been from the beginning. Quite simply the working classes who have read about the actions of Smith and others are quite happy to describe them as nonces. Every senior member of the SWP that I know or have read about have had zero contact with the working class. Most of them are in professional employment,many are lecturers and teachers. Now I have read your defence of Martin Smith's relationship with a student of 17 elsewhere and am aware you do not see anything wrong with it, your problem, you live with it.jimboonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-89988434913542945662013-02-27T23:56:46.630+00:002013-02-27T23:56:46.630+00:00I'd be interested to know Jimboo what makes yo...I'd be interested to know Jimboo what makes you believe you speak for the working class in the first place - the fantasist here seems to be you.Ben Sorinnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-31461661675093020312013-02-27T19:13:20.719+00:002013-02-27T19:13:20.719+00:00"What will it take for the penny to drop?&quo..."What will it take for the penny to drop?"<br /><br />A disastrous Marxism this summer should do the trickMr Spartypantsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-65913104866660789012013-02-27T18:49:14.711+00:002013-02-27T18:49:14.711+00:00I think it's fair to say the SWP won't be ...I think it's fair to say the SWP won't be screwing up many more young people after March 10th.Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06298147857234479278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-15815502319492269622013-02-27T17:36:27.324+00:002013-02-27T17:36:27.324+00:00The SWP have never really been a force for good. S...The SWP have never really been a force for good. Such is their contempt for other activists their paranoia forces them to destroy any united front that they cannot control. They are middle-class fantasists who have no connection with the working class activists. Their contempt for the working class being so strong that Cliff expelled many shop stewards who could think for themselves. Of the 20 members in my area, one working class trade unionists. One educationalists is even on the management committee of his university forcing through cuts. hypocrite. Reading Comrade Anna's statement above the CC having lost this generation of students now seem to be hellbent on grabbing the next generation for Swapper Fodder. If generations of activists had not been contaminated by the SWP the left may have had some decent radical youngsters.jimboonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-7154459595264531162013-02-26T23:45:26.736+00:002013-02-26T23:45:26.736+00:00My experience of the SWP is that it does centralis...My experience of the SWP is that it does centralism well and internal democracy not very well. Strangely that’s not necessarily a critical failing – when I was a member that centralism was mitigated by the fact that the CC needed to persuade rank and file members of their position for it to be effective and that had a disciplinary effect on the leadership - to some degree. Now that check seems under threat.<br /> <br />As far the members on the list, there are undoubtedly some who would sign up to any statement that the Central Committee issued because the CC issued it. But there are a number of others – as Pete Green argued – who are first class fighters and people. I imagine they support the statement as they believe that their party is a force for good and that, even with its faults and its large failings on this issue, its best way of moving forward and achieving more things in the future is through support for a decision which has already been taken at conference – their constitutional forum for taking major party decisions. Those on the list have it badly wrong this time around, of course, but I’m very uneasy with the characterisation of them as apparatchiks/cowards/ hacks. I know a number of Labour party members of principle who have remained in that party and voted to support its leadership despite the Iraq war, attacks on civil liberties and the treatment of asylum seekers (to name a few things) under New Labour - policies they deeply disagreed with, but a party they stuck to in the belief that it resulted in net good. I don’t think several of the SWPers on this list are behaving much differently in this instance.Ben Sorinnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-61060379132036149172013-02-26T08:45:27.459+00:002013-02-26T08:45:27.459+00:00What I also find annoying is the way conferece pla...What I also find annoying is the way conferece places are elected. How does doncaster take down more than one person when they have lost nearly all members and have three left? When we raised issues and were ignored we joined the left platform. We were immediately told wehad to get elected at a Sheffield aggregate. We replied not on your Nelly and they couldn't do a thing about it. They are trying the very same tactic again. Its a totaljoke and older comrades who say this is acceptable well, the mind boggles. Democratic centralism doesn't mean handing over your brain. louisedoncasternoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-49587537565548605372013-02-26T08:36:42.879+00:002013-02-26T08:36:42.879+00:00Doncaster has really only three, a female comrade ...Doncaster has really only three, a female comrade has been put down twice. Interestingly enough found out recently that a young woman was told about me and my socialist activism, that it wasn't up to scratch because I'm a feminist. Luckily for me her and Donny she rejected hipoor analysis. What's more interesting about this is that we have the worst rates of domestic violence and child abuse for our size and also the worst public sector cuts, which yes you've guessed it affects women and children the most. I thought it was an active socialists job at this time to highlight the inequality aspects of the cuts and campaign accordingly. I'd like to be able to say the Donny comrades had helped on this most difficult period. But that would be factually incorrect. louisedoncasternoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-54250455834931742262013-02-25T01:25:53.584+00:002013-02-25T01:25:53.584+00:00'Taking the long view
We are now in the 7th ye...'Taking the long view<br />We are now in the 7th year of a worldwide capitalist crisis. The depth<br />of the crisis in countries such as Greece is leading to deep<br />polarisation between the left and the Fascist right. The UK is in a<br />triple dip recession. There are no signs of any serious recovery.<br />The history of our party (and of the Bolsheviks and indeed other<br />organisations in our tendency) prove the need for a unified, Leninist<br />organisation which can provide a revolutionary pole of attraction for<br />the working class.<br /><br />There is a huge fear amongst our comrades that if we are too hard in<br />holding the positions democratically won at our conference, branches<br />and elected national committee we will lose many of the young student<br />members of our organisation. None of us want that to happen. However,<br />we also have to be clear that whilst engaging in a political argument<br />to win and keep as many comrades as possible, we cannot hold on to<br />members at a political price which will fundamentally damage our<br />ability to organise in the working class.<br /><br />New students arrive at colleges every year. If we raise the level of<br />politics to fit the present situation the SWP can recruit and develop<br />layers of Marxist students successfully.<br /><br />To preserve a revolutionary current in this country for the inevitable<br />struggles ahead we need to ensure that we fight to win all comrades to<br />a democratic centralist position in practise as well as in name. And,<br />at the same time, we need to demand and enforce with discipline if<br />necessary the right of the majority of members to have decisions<br />respected and our action to be unified. Without that we cannot<br />effectively move forward in this epoch of crises, wars and<br />revolutions.<br /><br />Proposed: Anna <br />Seconded: Alan<br />Tottenham Branch'Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-46107089949131336762013-02-24T20:38:29.684+00:002013-02-24T20:38:29.684+00:00Had to dig out the text books and blow away the du...Had to dig out the text books and blow away the dust. Thinking along the lines of Bion and the Fight/Flight scenario. The enemy within the group must be attacked but in doing so an enemy outside the group is created. (imaginary but in the present SWP case real.) The SWP had the choice of engaging the external enemy or evading conflict. They have chosen conflict with the wider movement. I do not think they will survive as a group. jimboonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-82448838400715843212013-02-24T19:12:19.719+00:002013-02-24T19:12:19.719+00:00There has got to be someone in the Lynch Mob facti...There has got to be someone in the Lynch Mob faction that has to realise this is wrecking the SWP's reputation in the labour movement (which was never great anyway). What will it take for the penny to drop?Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06298147857234479278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-85430495060172616882013-02-24T11:56:55.912+00:002013-02-24T11:56:55.912+00:00This thing has not even come to the boil yet. Many...This thing has not even come to the boil yet. Many people are only now finding out within the last few days that we are talking about a man, in a positon of power, in his mid 40's and a child of 17. The serious rape accusations being made when she was 19. The Class are not happy at all.jimboonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-74634778008457631412013-02-23T01:49:03.189+00:002013-02-23T01:49:03.189+00:00I am deeply saddened to see the names of several p...I am deeply saddened to see the names of several people on this list whom I've held in high regard.<br /><br />I am outraged to see some names on this list of people who campaign on behalf of gender equality issues. And some who will be representing the women members of their unions at the TUC Women's conference next month. How can they possibly reconcile support for the CC with representing women trade union members?<br /><br />I am disgusted to see that one of the names on this list is the organiser of a pro-choice counter-demo against an anti-abortion protest tomorrow. How can anyone defending the way the SWP's appalling handling of a rape allegation and its attacks on feminism have the bare-faced cheek to claim to be campaigners for gender equality?!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-36090583566204007952013-02-20T17:14:50.449+00:002013-02-20T17:14:50.449+00:00I note that a couple of UCU folks in there have ha...I note that a couple of UCU folks in there have had the effrontery in the past to lecture me on "justice".<br /><br />I'll have some choice phrases ready for next time that is attempted.<br /><br />Mike HolmesAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17283342703845338916noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-45956965366898066142013-02-19T12:37:49.641+00:002013-02-19T12:37:49.641+00:00I don't know which of the last two comments ar...I don't know which of the last two comments are the most incredible.Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06298147857234479278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-82711503192039117062013-02-19T12:30:04.328+00:002013-02-19T12:30:04.328+00:00you're all going to hell, pricks.you're all going to hell, pricks.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-742682118908540202013-02-18T12:38:02.687+00:002013-02-18T12:38:02.687+00:00My sister-in-law went to the Unison womens confere...My sister-in-law went to the Unison womens conference as an SWP member. She said there were no problems at all and they were made to feel very welcome apart from the final motion which we opposed, rightfully so, on principle. Sometimes you have to stand up and say something even if its unpopular - thats Bolshevism. Grow a f**king backbone.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com