tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post4701497235568670728..comments2024-03-29T09:14:53.583+00:00Comments on All That Is Solid ...: The Politics of Royal Mail PrivatisationPhilhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06298147857234479278noreply@blogger.comBlogger15125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-72120913056610866822013-09-17T10:45:31.734+01:002013-09-17T10:45:31.734+01:00The current percentages doing the rounds of Stoke ...The current percentages doing the rounds of Stoke are 77% against any sell and I think that figure is quite low.<br />Cost neutral policies are slightly more complicated at local level than at national level of where my sole ambition once lay. However, some of the Tory policies coming out of Stoke recently will be a joy to shout down and demolish on all fronts social-if I were to be involved.<br /><br />Of the other matter in hand:<br />Oh dear, the aftermath will be amusing, to say the least.<br /> Gary Elsbynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-91129184531371597602013-09-16T21:10:04.135+01:002013-09-16T21:10:04.135+01:00I agree with you, Gary. The Labour position is arg...I agree with you, Gary. The Labour position is argued out of what the powers that be think is electoral expediency. They think it's necessary. I'm sure there are some in the shadow cabinet that think it's desirable.<br /><br />As you know, there might be a smidgen of a possibility that a by-election could occur soon. I'd be interested to hear some of your cost-neutral proposals a Cllr Gary Elsby might push should you be successful.Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06298147857234479278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-25484844732938317512013-09-15T15:24:31.971+01:002013-09-15T15:24:31.971+01:00No Phil, it was your response that wasn't quit...No Phil, it was your response that wasn't quite good, my original post.was much better.<br />Building new council houses (social) means new build and jobs. Passing on or lower rents could argue a case for deterioration.<br />Labour should enter the 2015 election with my 2010 manifesto and be adventurous with it.<br />If asked nicely, I could spare another few hours writing the entire new manifesto for Labour.<br />Please note Phil, that I consider it a personal challenge to write cost neutral policies which by definition are appealing and have teeth.<br />Labour screw themselves by sticking to Tory plans (you say we reject and you baffle us) and will confuse all by promising big spends.<br /><br />Selling Royal Mail should be a crime and possibly will be due to its current special EU status as 'pan provider' for GB mail delivery requiring zero tax status.Gary Elsbynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-83890358825001887812013-09-14T18:39:00.908+01:002013-09-14T18:39:00.908+01:00Boffy - why would anyone want to buy the Royal Mai...Boffy - why would anyone want to buy the Royal Mail?<br /><br />I can think of lots of reasons.<br />1) the government has loaded the public purse with the old pension costs, sometehing previous governments resolutely avoided doing, thus the organisation is a lot 'lighter' than it used to be.<br />2) previous privatisations indicate that it won't be sold at anything like true market price, thus instant profit!<br />3) It owns a great deal of useful and well sited land which can be pillaged as the service is run down, which brings me to 4,<br />4) a managed, deliberate run down with maximum profit extraction through destruciton of workforce pay and conditions, land sales, running machines* until they break etc etc, will make lots of money for a few years for the people who matter, i.e. the senior management and the major shareholders. After that they offload it to some mug and get out of Dodge.<br /><br />* contrary to popular opinion and conservative propaganda, there's a shedload of modern technology and automation in the Royal Mail and they are always catching up with modern methods and technologies. <br /><br />As another point, this is a way marker on march to destroy civil national society. A one cost for a letter postal service was a public good; with the destruction of such a service and the takeover of new media, internet etc by corporations, all citizens will have to buy only what services they can afford, meaning proper class segregation and the poor being shown their place, rather than being treated the same as everyone else. guthrienoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-85813403445953584832013-09-14T11:16:24.175+01:002013-09-14T11:16:24.175+01:00Your comment was almost a good one, Gary.
There a...Your comment was almost a good one, Gary.<br /><br />There are three things here.<br /><br />1. The economic recovery is lopsided. If it doesn't address and exacerbates the underlying economic problems then no, I don't think that's worth celebrating. From your own perspective, think about the council move. That is economic activity and would count toward GDP figures. But would you count that as good growth?<br /><br />2. I'm not completely opposed to selling off council houses provided they're replaced like for like. What would be much better IMO is massive rent discounts after a house has been inhabited for some years, up to and including zero rents and the possibility of passing it on to family members to rent.<br /><br />3. You're spot on about parcels. But I'm sure you're aware that Labour's programme isn't going to be about 'protesting'. Who knows, when it appears you might find some things you like in it.Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06298147857234479278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-60467506445981538552013-09-14T11:09:42.687+01:002013-09-14T11:09:42.687+01:00HI Asquith, rural Tories come in all shapes and si...HI Asquith, rural Tories come in all shapes and sizes. What the Tory party risk alienating are that core, elderly vote that have voted Tory all their lives out of habit rather than conviction. They are that layer who are deeply attached to British institutions and are also likely to be dependent on public services in some way. They will not be happy to see the Queen's head in private hands.Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06298147857234479278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-74393579717278492292013-09-14T11:04:32.463+01:002013-09-14T11:04:32.463+01:00While you're right about mail Boffy, parcels a...While you're right about mail Boffy, parcels are booming in a big way - big enough to sustain a competitive market. Also, while "conventional" mail volumes have gone down there as been a huge spike in junk mail. I swear I never used to get as much crap from my bank or energy providers.Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06298147857234479278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-92029418050769296562013-09-13T14:44:28.193+01:002013-09-13T14:44:28.193+01:00Like always once it's sold it will be difficul...Like always once it's sold it will be difficult to buy back... simple put not everything is going to make massive profits and the Royal Mail and the post offices are two of those.treborchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01473357437003490328noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-50596003832662399922013-09-13T13:48:15.763+01:002013-09-13T13:48:15.763+01:00You make an economic recovery almost sound like a ...You make an economic recovery almost sound like a dirty word.<br /><br />What's wrong with selling council houses to council tenants?<br />Many Labour members did just that.<br />What is wrong is not using the money to build new council houses.<br /><br />The Tories bounced at least one election off the back of a war and Labour lost a hat-trick because socialism was the poor relation to the rich privatisation schemes and ever increasing affluence of the workers.<br /><br />Royal Mail, if sold, will go headlong into the parcel market on day one and make many investors quite rich in the process. Rich people are rubbing their hands at that un-publicised prospect.<br />They make their profit at the moment on the back of letters but not for long.<br /><br />I can't see Labour winning the next GE on the back of a protest, it has to win on the promise of proven affluence for the workers.<br />Ed promises to be a good Tory if he wins and also promises to spend like one too.<br />That's one shite sell.Gary Elsbynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-14191870998653923342013-09-12T22:07:54.783+01:002013-09-12T22:07:54.783+01:00Witless from Witney is one of those pub bore types...Witless from Witney is one of those pub bore types who can't see the wood because his vision's blocked by a sapling. He thinks he's stumbled upon a holy grail, a master key to which everything else is so much chaff and has no bearing on the issue to hand. Never mind that privatisation is factored into Tory strategy, never mind it involves dumping on a highly organised group of workers, never mind it will give the economic figures a good massage; it all comes down to an EU directive that "no one else" has noticed. Eureka!<br /><br />Of course, it would be helpful if Witless actually read the directives. If he had, he would have found it says nothing about privatising postal companies in state ownership. Yes, they are neoliberal directives for sure that talk about opening markets up. That's clearly happened in the UK postal service sector. But it doesn't specify that firms have to be sold off.<br /><br />What the Tories are doing is *one possible* way of conforming to EU directives. And it's the way that suits their interests. Therefore the issue of the hour is not to moan about the EU like some one trick pony, but ask why they are choosing to implement it this way.Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06298147857234479278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-806748522034888242013-09-12T21:55:41.139+01:002013-09-12T21:55:41.139+01:00http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/alex-massie/2013/09/y...http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/alex-massie/2013/09/yes-royal-mail-should-be-privatised/<br /><br />Not bad about the political side of things. And I think you're right about Bliar, and his triangulation wasn't an embrace of liberalism but simply an acceptance of the Thatcherite status quo (and Tories aren't really liberal, but upholders of their own class interests, who may prefer capitalism generally but will use state mechanisms like farm subsidies if authentic liberalism doesn't suit their aim of keeping themselves rich and generally on top).<br /><br />One thing though. Aren't rural, anti-privatisation Tories the exact sort of people who are most likely to be going kipper? Kippers aren't all libertarian bloggers, they gained by embracing homophobia and already Farage is blaming this on Europe and vaguely hinting it wouldn't be happening on his watch.<br /><br />Whereas urban, culturally liberal capitalists, the George Osbornes of this world, are going to be among the keenest customers. He and his fancy London mates will like this a lot more than people in Witney or Grantham.asquithhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14246701347539264295noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-58971351501182970432013-09-12T20:59:26.375+01:002013-09-12T20:59:26.375+01:00@Ultra_Fox
It is well known that some Member Stat...@Ultra_Fox<br /><br />It is well known that some Member States will attempt to defer the imposition of Directives - and France is one of the most notorious in that regard.<br /><br />However, such MS will have to comply eventually, as you must realise.<br /><br />The fact that we in the UK comply so readily is purely the wish of our political class to be seen as good Europeans - and the most obedient of dogs, which said political class most surely are.<br /><br />In that respect, your question about France and Germany is neither here nor there - sorry.WitteringsfromWitneyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16026875251366365154noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-1926867818466498322013-09-12T19:21:51.413+01:002013-09-12T19:21:51.413+01:00@WitteringsfromWitney
Don't other EU countrie...@WitteringsfromWitney<br /><br />Don't other EU countries, most notably France and Germany, still retain their postal services under public/state ownership?<br /><br />Ultra_Foxhttp://electriccello.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-91757198416440570882013-09-12T17:35:51.056+01:002013-09-12T17:35:51.056+01:00"These are the politics of the Royal Mail sel..."These are the politics of the Royal Mail sell-off......"<br /><br />How wrong you are! Not one word in your article about three EU Directives that re behind this move by the Coalition.<br /><br />May I suggest you read:<br /><br />http://witteringsfromwitney.com/state-of-the-eunion-addresspostal-sell-off/<br /><br />Perhaps if you threw off your socialist blinkers, you might just see things clearer?WitteringsfromWitneyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16026875251366365154noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4486641877026778105.post-68567105765243368742013-09-12T16:36:07.622+01:002013-09-12T16:36:07.622+01:00The question is who would want to buy it? As I po...The question is who would want to buy it? As I pointed out some time ago, the only way such a business is likely to be able to survive is if it is allowed to expand into all areas of communications.<br /><br />There can be little future for snail mail now that everything is being made paperless, and communication becomes electronic in one form or another. Royal Mail would then really need to be able to go into the business of becoming an ISP. It would also need to go into the business of telecoms, which would have been easier had it not been separated from BT 30 years ago. Also, it would be preferable to have had the post offices as part of the business, if they could be converted into a banking arm.<br /><br />In fact, all the actions used to set up various bits for privatisation have undermined the overall business. My guess is that as happened with buses and with trains, pressure to maintain some social responsibility for rural areas - where the Tories get votes - will mean that the privatisation legislation will require it to maintain a level of service provision even where its unprofitable. As with buses and trains, anyone taking on that responsibility will demand that they be compensated by the state for doing so.<br /><br />I doubt, especially when the monopoly is fully removed, as it stands it could run as profitable business, certainly not if it had to maintain unprofitable services to rural areas. So, like buses and trains, I would expect any future private business to be heavily subsidised by the State. In fact the train operators get bigger subsidies than British Rail ever received.<br /><br />Without that, I don't know why anyone would want to buy it, and even with it, it doesn't look attractive, because you never know how long those subsidies would last.Boffyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08157650969929097569noreply@blogger.com